Apple is asking for $40 per device from Samsung for 5 patents

March 12, 2014
Samsung Vs Apple Planets collide patent lawsuit

Apple thinks Samsung should pay a royalty rate of $40 for every Android smartphone and tablet it sells for just five patents.

According to FOSS Patents the patents in question relate to phone number tapping, unified search, data synchronization, slide to unlock, and autocomplete. It’s worth noting that these patents don’t cover everything regarding the five features, though they cover enough to justify the lawsuit in Apple’s eye, and the court agreed to hear arguments regarding them. Samsung had four patents included in the case when it first came about in 2011, but three of its claims have since been dropped.

Apple is asking more for just five patents than it asked Samsung to pay to license its entire patent portfolio four years ago. Sometime in 2010, before this litigation began, the two companies met and Apple asked Samsung to pay $30 per device sold. Under that deal Samsung would have paid $40 for every tablet sold for two years, but again that’s for the whole patent portfolio and not just five patents.

In the last major court battle between the two companies Apple asked for much less for its patents. The most expensive patent in that lawsuit was the pinch-to-zoom API, which is now ruled invalid. At the time Apple asked for $3.10 per device for that patent. In this case it’s asking for an average of $8 per patent per device or more than double pinch-to-zoom.

If Apple gets the royalty rates it’s asking for, it’ll probably be the largest royalty rate any manufacturer has to pay for any device. Microsoft famously receives money from many Android phone manufacturers for every phone sold through patent licensing deals. But even those only amount to between $10 and $20 per device according to analysts.

The case is scheduled to go in front of Judge Lucy Koh on March 31.

Whether you like or dislike Samsung it’s hard to deny that Apple is going a bit overboard with the royalties it’s seeking. Does Apple’s decision to ask for so much for each patent change your opinion of the company? Or does it just reinforce your current opinion of it?

Comments

  • Amadeus Klein

    Litigate instead of innovate is apples current motto… They see their growth beginning to stagnate as smartphones saturate and are seeking to offset that lack in revenue growth by suing…

    My first smart phone was an Apple, but their business practices drove me to Android after just a few years, now having been an android user almost as long as an Apple one, I can’t see myself switching back, not just due to the hardware but the company position in suing everyone it can leaves a very bad taste in my mouth…

    • Shark Bait

      That’s my issue with apple, I don’t agree with their business practices either. Locked down is a nightmare, and not a healthy market.

      I also don’t like how they sit on a big pile of cash instead of using it for something useful. I get the feeling that Google are trying to do something with their pile of cash. I get the impression Larry Paige really wants to make the world a better place, and then make some money on the side.

      • Balraj

        ur half right..
        but according to me google likes buying out very good companies n make money out of it
        very soon u ll realize it

        • Shark Bait

          Well that too, but they do put money into things like, cars, robotics, glass and other moonshots. That’s what I meant. Imagine what good apple could do if they just put some of that cash to good use

          • TheGCU

            That money’s for their stockholders! How dare you think about using that money for anything else?! How else will Apple keep them happy with their market share dropping like a rock?

          • Shark Bait

            My point exactly! The very same iddiots who care more about profit than sustainability

          • kyle sundberg

            I smell another lawsuit coming. lol

        • Amadeus Klein

          Google “is” buying companies and making profits, but that’s not the same thing at all… Apple doesn’t buy companies and grow profits, no they sue people to increase profits, They aren’t growing in market share much, but profits are growing, that is because of their litigation… Apple has a clear strategy to make more money and a major component of that strategy is litigation….

        • kyle sundberg

          you realize that apple does the exact same thing right? most recent is the company that came up with there fingerprint reader on the iPhone 5S….all they did was buy it out and apply it to there product.
          you’re*
          and*
          you’ll*
          and agreed with shark bait. they put there technology to good use. what does apple have…oh right. the apple TV. my life is all around better now

    • Balraj

      common give it a break..
      only if someone steals from your house.You’ll know how it feels
      I’m not a fan boy but running a company is not a piece of cake -.-
      Apple has it ways…its restricted yes but not useless

      android is also good but not everybody uses the add ons u get with it
      suing is not wrong…the court says samsung is guilty..its done

      • Amadeus Klein

        That’s not even a remotely similar situation, if someone steals from your house it’s gone, you then have to pay to replace your things and you can’t use the stolen items anymore…

        This is more like someone seeing how you cut your lawn and they copy you, that is if you want to stick with the “your house” metaphors.

        Unfortunately you seem like a FanBoi… You used an inaccurate metaphor, just to try to magnify a bad point, and you tried to troll with a statement nobody made a comment about before you. Nobody said apple is useless.

        AND

        Only in the US does the “court” see Samsung as guilty most of the time, around the world Apple hasn’t influenced the court system yet.

        Ask Judge Koh to show you her phone, I bet it’s an iPhone and I bet she didn’t pay a dime for it… Her “office” bought it for her…

        The court system in the US has a bias, these cases need to be heard in an international setting where neither company has as much influence over the court system.

        • Michael Samsara

          When the case was originally tried – after the verdict had come in – it turned out that a self-placed “ringer” had found his way on to the jury – and wonder of wonder, miracle of miracles – gotten himself the position of jury foreman. This fellow – had an ax to grind against Samsung as Samsung adequately and properly pointed out – but never being one to bow to reason or fact – Judge Koh determined it didn’t really affect the outcome of the jury’s verdict.

          Yeah, sure. Ever see the wonderful movie 12 Angry Men with Henry Fonda? Do, if you want to see the power that one man – can have on a jury and the outcome of its deliberations. In that case it saved the life of an innocent boy – in this case it allowed a miscarriage of justice to reign supreme and lies and chicanery to triumph over truth and justice.

          Thank you very much Judge Koh – for giving us another example of why California is considered the number one place to sue large corporations; where plaintiffs can always find a willing and biased ear to hear their spurious lawsuits born of fishing expeditions dreamt up by ambulance chasing lawyers.

    • TheWay

      Samsung that’s a good deal you should take it! but the rumor its a lie i highly doubt Apple wants that, what they want is their products to be different than others so they using those patents to protect themselfs how is that bad? Sony, Google and others respect that but Samsung knows only one way Apple’s way

      Whats the difference between China mobile and Samsung atleast Chinese phones are cheap

      HTC One copied iPhone 5 back but it doesnt matter cuz that was not patented by Apple

      • TerminatahX

        Is that Grape or Cherry Koolaid you are drinking?

      • Amadeus Klein

        Apple claimed to have patented the rectangular device… And many other things that are inherently not patentable… In this case maybe $5 per device sold but nothing more is within reason but even then I question the ability to patent things like tapping a keypad…

        Apple has proven o be a very effective patent troll, preferring litigation or mediation. As for them being different, that isn’t possible unless they start selling an apple shaped device… This is a profit strategy nothing more…

        • Michael Samsara

          Knight-Ridder way back when – in a case related to the big one – was proven to have first come up with the idea of a pad with screen with attendant intimations – prescient as hell as they were – as to where all of this would one day go.

          Apparently, once again – flying in the face of reason and fact and commonsense – this little detail and the fact someone else had already come up with the idea “a rectangular device with a screen on it” didn’t make a whits worth of difference to Her Honor Judge – mentally – odd way of thinking.

  • Ben_24

    Why doesn’t Apple take Google to court? It’s an android software feature is it not? I’m happy to be corrected but I also ha

    • zuke

      Two main reasons, one is that before the implementation of android reaches the device the manufacturer builds a theme of sorts for it (except on nexus phones), this theme can replace all sorts of functionality from the look and feel or notification bar down to the quirks of the scroll function. It’s possible these patents cover functions that are Samsung flavored. Second I think apple feels like there’s more money to be made from Samsung’s phone manufacturing than from Google’s OS Dev section.

    • http://galaxynote3tips.blogspot.com/ Martens Nkem

      Google gives android away for free so that would sort of shield them from litigation

    • TheWay

      Because Google and Android did not infringe Apple patents but Samsung did!

  • systemupdate

    Apple is really high…

    • JuanK

      :)

  • Guest123

    Where’s Judge Posner when you need him?

    Being awarded a patent does NOT mean the patent is worth anything and that anyone would pay more to have those features or not.

  • Barlong

    Lol, seems blowing up one of Samsung factory wasn’t enough for Apple.

    Ok Samsung, time to stop wasting your money on those stupid lawyers. You’ll never win on Apple soil, all judges there have been corrupted by forbidden fruit.

  • Jesus

    I really want to smash an Apple right now.

    Who the F do they think they are? Jesus??

    • mustbepbs

      I’ll be eating an apple for lunch.

      And I’m gonna like it.

  • Marsg

    Lol asking for 40$ per device but when asked to pay Samsung 2$ per device for 3g/4g tech they said it was unreasonable , Apple is full of feces.

    • Bonzai

      I’m not taking one side or the other here but in the 3g/4g case you are referring to Samsung was suing over standard-essential patents, which was wrong on their part. They’re not supposed to sue using those.

      • Jeff Moreira

        This whole system is fucked.
        Samsung can’t charge too much for standard patents but, Apple can with this shit patents (some that have been around before) and get a product ban.
        How unfair is that?

        • woleakindoyin

          the whole system isnt fucked. just Apple

        • TheWay

          Multi-touch screen, Mac Paint, Folders, Tracking Ball pad, Numeric Keyboard and others those are standard patents

          If court allowed standard patents Windows would probably wouldn’t exist

      • Marsg

        Apple din’t argue the case that they shouldn’t have to pay anything because they were standard but that they should only have to pay .005 cents per device lol. Also the patent for multitasking (playing music in background) that Samsung sued apple over isn’t a essential patent in the same way scroll bounce is not either. As every blogger and commenter have pointed out, this sum of 40$ is just complete ludacris, especially given the fact that Apple got two of the patents by mistake. The patents technically already belong to another company. Why should they be allowed to sue someone on patents they don’t even own.

  • M3D1T8R

    This innovation crushing patent trolling has got to stop. All the big companies are in on it, making it really hard for any innovative small new players to come up and threaten them.

    • K

      I agree.

  • Tyrone_83

    I don’t know how people can support and stand by Apple if all their doing is suing everybody.

    • TheWay

      so Samsung stands for everybody!!

      • TheWay

        ?????

      • Brandon Lee Bohn

        A lot more reasonable with consumers than apple

  • filaos

    Apple haters, it’s time to express yourselves !

    • Bryan Z

      lol!

    • TheWay

      more like Samsung trash lol!

  • http://galaxynote3tips.blogspot.com/ Martens Nkem

    This is just crazy, like seriously how much does Apple pay Nokia for patents that actually does something important

  • Say What?

    I’m so sick of Apple and their brainwashing. People are less educated about a lot of things now-a-days and Apple feeds off that. This is typical taking advantage of American society as most corporations try and do.

  • KB

    I really don’t understand this patent system, I thought it was to protect non-obvious/unique inventions and ideas from being copied. I have no idea what phone number tapping means. Unified search is something I thought was created in the early 90s for unix servers. Is there something special about data synchronization that was not an option on palm and/or blackberries before apple was doing phones? Slide to unlock was mentioned by Arthur C. Clark and Gene Roddenberry had written about this feature idea on portable tablets in the 70s. Autocomplete was something Bruce Bastian was trying to make work when Wordperfect was on DOS. How are they allowed to patent stuff that has minor changes from unlocking gesture on touchpads to touch screen, thats one minor difference that does nothing to change the functional purpose.
    I just dont understand…GRR.

    • TheGCU

      You’re exactly right. The problem is that most of these patents shouldn’t even have been granted in the first place. You can’t patent an idea, just a particular implementation of that idea. So the proprietary software code that Apple uses for something can be patented, but not the entire concept. Nobody should be able to own “slide-to-unlock”, but everybody should have their own way of doing it. That’s why nobody owns the patent for “a car”. You can’t patent a box with four wheels and an engine, but you can patent your particular design. And I know it’s old, but you can’t own a shape, either.

  • williamsteven

    That is why I never give even a little f**k from the beginning! Sorry never intend to empower the dark force!

  • http://batman-news.com Santosh Reddy

    Just one think…anyone who knows apple in any way knows one thing that its an expensive brand…so i would construe the question as a single rhetorical question

    • TheWay

      Its not, Apple has one feature that no one has “Hardware and Software config.” that alone should cost more than 3000$. Macs are expensives but don’t blame Apple you should blame Intel!

      • TheGCU

        How is the price of a Mac Intel’s fault? Mac’s were expensive long before they used Intel chips.

        • TheWay

          Have you not seen Jobs movie? they want to have the most powerfull pc’s to at decent price wich was impossible but they learn from their mistakes, come on 2000$ for a f^king Intel video card or try to configure Surface Pro at max. you get the same result price like the Macbook air
          Apple the more they sell the cheaper their products become

          • TheGCU

            Because Hollywood biopics are known for being 100% right about everything. What does Intel have to do with this? Apple is a company with shareholders who demand more profit every year. As market share drops like a rock, they need to make money somehow to keep the shareholders happy.

          • TheWay

            If Apple switches from Intel to Arm wich they will! then you will understand, no i’m not saying Hollywood are 100$ right but about that yes.. you and me as noob we had probably done the same thing just like Steve did
            But lets end this im here to trash Samsung nothing more

          • TheGCU

            WTF are you talking about? What does the movie have do to with any of this? Do you even know how to make sense? You still haven’t said what Intel has to do with any of this.

          • TheWay

            The person i replied he said that everybody knows that Apple is an expensive brand and i told him in short that is full of crap wrong!!!Because everybody knows when you buy an iPhone or Mac you get exactly what you paid for!!!!!but when you buy a Samsung or windows pc its like throwing your money away
            Don’t try to deny that! and then you came with Apple history lessons and i told you to to watch the fu%kning movie!
            Sure you know about Apple history more than Hollywood does GTFO HERE!
            Good luck playing GTA SA on your S III because it works perfectly on my 4S

          • TheGCU

            WTF are you talking about? Is anybody else seeing these posts? Do you work for Apple? I gave Apple history lessons? Did you even read my posts or do you just hit reply and type whatever comes to mind?

            The fact that you play GTA SA says it all I think.

          • TheWay

            Sanstosh Reedish:
            anyone who knows apple in any way knows one thing that its an expensive brand
            TheWay: Its not..ex.Macs are expensives but don’t blame Apple you should blame Intel!
            U:
            Mac’s were expensive long before they used Intel chips
            TheWay:
            Have you not seen Jobs movie? they want to have the most powerfull pc’s to at decent price wich was impossible but they learn from their mistakes, but what is the past has to do Mac in present? PC back then was also expensive
            Mac with Intel = expensive
            iOS with ARM= Good price

            WTF YOU DONT UNDERSTAND

          • TheGCU

            What you’re talking about and why it has any relevance to the article above. You’ve gone in a completely different direction that has nothing to do with what anybody else here is talking about.

            And if you’re getting your facts from a movie, that says it all.

          • TheWay

            What you’re talking about and why it has any relevance to the article above- YOUR RIGHT it doesnt but you should tell that to Santosh Reddy not me

          • TheWay

            Work for Apple? you mean talking trash about Apple’s competetion no!,thats a Samsung thing.or you mean real Apple employer if i was do you think i’ll still be here wasting my time with you?

          • Brandon Lee Bohn

            So you would rather pay 700 for overrated device that’s just mediocre, this day in age who is innovating more samsung , look how short android evolved, what was the biggest thing apple did..oh that’s right let’s change out exchange policy to higher price, and let’s bring out the 5c, oh let’s copy android because were a dying company

      • http://batman-news.com Santosh Reddy

        Maybe there should be a term greater than a fan boy now

        • Brandon Lee Bohn

          Typical fan boy at its finest lol TheWay is pointless

  • http://sagaciousresearch.com/ Sagacious Research

    Apple’s
    thought of receiving royalty rate from Samsung for every smartphone and
    tablet it sells will get apple the largest royalty rate ever. And according
    to us apple is really being over enthusiastic on the royalties it’s looking
    for.

  • woleakindoyin

    can Apple just leave Samsung alone biko. Its annoying that whenever you hear Apple and Samsung together, the next thing that follows is about war between the two. I think Apple has inferiority complex or they are just scared that Samsung is winning the market with there Android devices.

  • Mike

    Projecting Gartner’s numbers forward for the full year 2014, Apple’s global share of the smartphone market is likely to be in single figures by the year end. They have to make their money somehow ;-)

    http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/2623415

  • Lisandro O Oocks

    They can’t be taken serious when they claim to have a patent on phone number tapping.

    • TheGCU

      Remember when they said they’d patented the rectangle?

  • just>me

    Will Apple and Samsung trial ever end?

    • TheWay

      no! because Apple doesn’t negociate with criminals!

      • Brandon Lee Bohn

        Typical apple fan girl

  • Brendon Brown

    40$ is the profit Samsung makes on all their low end phones.
    Samsung makes most money on low end phones.
    Apple is literally trying to eliminate the mobile division for Samsung…. Fucking Apple..

  • GJV

    Apple’s motto: If you can’t innovate, litigate.

  • TerminatahX

    Further evidence that Apple is more adept at patent trolling and litigation than actually competing in the free marketplace. Apple has run out of ideas so their business model clearly needs to shift toward litigation to profitability.

    • TheWay

      If Apple has run out of ideas why is Samsung still copying Apple?

      • Brandon Lee Bohn

        Copying apple? You this ignorant, apple OS is bland, look at the processor in apple, Samsung’s makes them, look at iOS 7, hey guys let’s copy Samsung by making the interface just like android , hey guys let’s dump Google maps and use our own(worst decision made next to iPhone 5c) hey guys let’s smoke pot and take Samsung to court because we’re a hipster company, fuck apple. No one wants to be restricted, everything that apple does is suckin on Samsung titties just to survive

        • needa

          lol. samsung definitely copies apple. they copied the hell out of them to get their smartphone businees off the ground and they are still copying them today. that isnt to say that apple isnt taking ideas from the android oems also. but to think that samsung does not copy apple is preposterous.

          • Brandon Lee Bohn

            Look it up, who makes apples processor, Samsung, why do u think apple is declining downhill, that can innovate shit except take Samsung to court they got all this money but lack of motivation, how long did android keep innovating itself 4 years probably less then that, you sound like a damn fanboy

          • needa

            fanboy. lol. i am not the one that sounds like the fanboy in this convo. i buy whatever phone suits my needs the best. this time around its moto. before that… samsung. and before that it was a couple of apples.
            everyone knows that samsung produces apple processors. they bid on the contract like everyone else. but apple designs those chips, not samsung. anyone can produce the chip. samsung just comes in at a lower price. so i havent the slightest clue as to why you would even bring it up.

  • Ken C

    Its the same thing Henry Ford tried to do when, because of his own inflexibility, he began to loose his market share. His own son pleaded with him to introduce new and innovative products but was publicly lambasted by his his father. This is the same old song and dance in a different era. Apple lost my attention long ago and until they take their rose colored glasses off and start competing instead of complaining then they’ll always be considered the biggest bully in the technology neighborhood. Good luck apple! I’m no longer one of your cool-aid drinking minions. I’m loving my new Quad Core, Full HD, 5.5 inch screen Android phone lol!

  • AP

    Apple is being useless as usual. What is there to patent about unified search ? Searching a device isn’t novel, blackberry did this before iPhone even hit the market. Hopefully this judge has half a brain and shoots it down without wasting time.

  • meterzero

    $40 for some useless features that I barely used??? Apple are usele$$ & consumer should learn to boycott this rubbish brand for good. Pity those who support these $pinele$$ company!

  • bigtrucker26

    I agree, that apple seems to be going overboard on the sue train. If samsung “stole” the codec for these features, well then maybe you have something. But I doubt if the implementation is the same, even if the final product works similar. When it comes to software, I start to get leary about the patent rights, just because something is similar, doesn’t mean it’s the same…. There is a line past which it becomes a matter of respect, recognition that something can be done, but the line runs real damn close to the original, and alot of times, to the codec it’s self. As for the ones specifically stated in this article-well frankly, it’s bs., all devices, of all types are striving and accomplishing these very ideas. The public wants touch screens only-so you have to enter numbers some how. The public wants data integration-searching and storing. The public wants accidental use prevention and ease of use. These are being applied to all devices, based on customer demand, not the innovation of one companies engineers. I find it lunacy that these kinds of suits are permitted, and that someone would demand so much for what the public demands-when they didn’t demand it specifically from one company.
    Someone had mentioned samsung sued apple for it’s 3g/4g tech. That I can get behind, in terms of hardware, and possibly software. And here is the difference-it was a New communications method/technology, which in it’s integration, requires the use of patent holder’s technology for their implementation.
    The sue income business model-except for lawyers, is proven to fail in the long term. The development, and implementation business model will always give ample opportunity for success.
    I fear we are in the last era of apple, they will continue to twitch successes for a time thanks to their fans, but the innovation, and independence of their company, has been lost. They are dooming themselves to the end, and it will likely take a real shakeup at the top to restore their company to success. They are a stalling truck on the tracks, and I can already hear the trains horns in the distance…. Will they be a pile of scrap, with who knows how many casualties in their wake, or will they stop, fix the innovation wire, and power themselves into the future, only time will tell.

  • robin2893

    i used to be apple fan, buy lot of their stuff and ever since the started lawsuit i stop buying their stuff